Comments on: Two Cents on AIG https://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/blog/2009/03/17/two-cents-on-aig/ Culture, Politics, Academia and Other Shiny Objects Wed, 18 Mar 2009 19:06:27 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=5.4.15 By: Timothy Burke https://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/blog/2009/03/17/two-cents-on-aig/comment-page-1/#comment-6324 Wed, 18 Mar 2009 19:06:27 +0000 http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=761#comment-6324 Legal realpolitik as practiced by corporations certainly follows fridaykr’s observations in many many other circumstances. Companies frequently bring lawsuits on intellectual property concerns knowing that the party they are suing cannot afford to contest the issue. Companies take actions of all kinds that are at least legally contestable when they judge that the other party doesn’t dare pursue legal redress.

I don’t approve of that conduct, but what’s fascinating is that people like Calomiris who otherwise would condone doing business in that way are suddenly stricken by it.

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By: marc_london https://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/blog/2009/03/17/two-cents-on-aig/comment-page-1/#comment-6323 Wed, 18 Mar 2009 18:56:43 +0000 http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=761#comment-6323 I agree with the comments above regarding the importance of honouring contracts out of respect for the rule of law but i seem to recall that Obama specifically said that these bonus will be clawed back through any LEGAL means possible.

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By: fridaykr https://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/blog/2009/03/17/two-cents-on-aig/comment-page-1/#comment-6305 Wed, 18 Mar 2009 14:37:49 +0000 http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=761#comment-6305 Contracts often exist where there are asymmetries of power, say between an employer and employee or between a provider and customer. Some may assume that a contract is used to protect the weaker of two parties and that the value of a contract lies in the consequences that ensue when a contract is violated or abrogated.

However, it seems like in many cases the asymmetries of power have grown so large, and the ability to delivery meaningful consequences has diminished to such a degree, that many contracts have ceased to function in a meaningful way. To take your example of contracts with service providers, I have often felt like such contracts are meaningless; if a provider doesn’t honor its contract, what recourse do ordinary citizens really have? Even in cases where failures to honor contracts are probably illegal, the resouces needed to obtain recourse are prohibitive for many individuals.

AIG should use this logic. If contracts by definition favor one part over another, AIG could decide not to honor its contracts with its employees who received bonuses, and let such employees decide whether it is worth their while to go public and sue.

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By: Timothy Burke https://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/blog/2009/03/17/two-cents-on-aig/comment-page-1/#comment-6304 Wed, 18 Mar 2009 13:40:55 +0000 http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=761#comment-6304 IANAL, but it does seem to me that there are some real oddities about contracts as they exist in our current experience. For example, I have “contractual” relationships to a wide variety of service providers, and often have to assent to those contracts at the start of service via a EULA or TOS. But the terms of these contracts can be unilaterally altered, leaving the service recipient only two choices: agree to the new contract or cancel the service. (Third unofficial option, as demonstrated with Facebook recently: make enough noise that the provider backs off.)

Aside from the legal issues, though, it seems to me that our popular moral understandings of contract are as messy and contradictory as moral mapping of debt is. I wonder if anybody has done a good ethnographic study of contract as an idea and practice in the U.S., in fact. For example, there was a recent story about a University of Florida professor who was trying to fight a demand by the administration that she teach an additional class when she was hired to teach a 1/1 load with administrative responsibilities as well. Not surprisingly, the online brickbats started flying, occasioned largely by the idea that her workload was too cushy. Only a few people pointed out that this was a contractual relationship and that it was moral for her to enforce it. But most of the people complaining about the professor in this instance would likely argue that a lot of other contractual obligations in our society are and should remain sacrosanct, not so much as a matter of law but as a matter of moral obligation. Beyond a likely consensus that you can’t contractually be bound to perform illegal actions, I suspect there’s a really messy popular landscape around what contracts are and should be in moral and social terms.

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By: AndrewSshi https://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/blog/2009/03/17/two-cents-on-aig/comment-page-1/#comment-6303 Wed, 18 Mar 2009 12:50:53 +0000 http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=761#comment-6303 Oh, there’s no argument that signing a contract to grant ridiculous bonuses is not exactly the soundest of business practices. But this is why the U.S. government, as the majority shareholder in AIG, should use its position to fire the worst offenders, not a reason to void already signed contracts.

I’m not a fan of the whole “circumstances are changed, so this contract can be voided” argument under any circumstances. Because if it can be used against people who are clearly malefactors, it can also be used against people who aren’t.

For example, at a certain research university, a few years back the university had agreed to increase the minimum stipend for graduate students over the course of three years as part of a settlement with the TA union. Well, when the university ran into financial difficulty because their stock portfolio (like everyone else’s) had tanked, they said that the promised pay raise had only been a promise to try and raise the minimum stipend if it were possible. At which point the TA union said, “Oh no you don’t,” went to the labor board, and the university very quickly backed down. Now then, the reason that the union was able to do that was because they had a binding guarantee, so that when the university said, “reality has intervened,” the union was able to throw a bullsh*t flag. The happy ending was that we did get our pay raise.

Now then, I hate to sound like a high school civics teacher on this one, but if you can void the contract for a collection of malfeasant executives at will, then the contract for a collection of graduate students isn’t any safer. I for one do not want to start down that road. And yes, I know I sound like a high school government teacher lecturing on the Bill of Rights. But there’s a reason we have high school government teachers.

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By: Doug https://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/blog/2009/03/17/two-cents-on-aig/comment-page-1/#comment-6302 Wed, 18 Mar 2009 11:11:27 +0000 http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=761#comment-6302 Time to update our Voltaire: “Dans ce pay-ci, il est bon de tuer de temps en temps un financier pour encourager les autres.” More encouragement, please.

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By: Timothy Burke https://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/blog/2009/03/17/two-cents-on-aig/comment-page-1/#comment-6301 Wed, 18 Mar 2009 03:48:41 +0000 http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=761#comment-6301 I’m a bit curious about the contract argument simply because I wonder why on earth they’d continue to refer to them as bonuses if they were contractually obligatory compensation. I would really like to hear a bit more about the contractual language that is supposedly so binding, if only to confirm much of what I think about the company’s mismanagement. If they (and other firms) have contractual language that obligates them to pay “bonuses” in an absolutely inescapable way, then it’s simply one more bit of evidence that they were all run in a totally boneheaded way.

Calomiris did make fridaykr’s second argument, that you’ve got to have these specific employees because they’re the only ones who know the full measure of the credit default swaps and thus are invaluable in untangling them. That’s fine, but my point about their marketability specifically holds against that. I hadn’t thought that there would be any mileage in using that knowledge to bet against the company simply because I think credit default swaps of this kind are almost certainly going to be the first major target of new regulation.

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By: AndrewSshi https://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/blog/2009/03/17/two-cents-on-aig/comment-page-1/#comment-6300 Wed, 18 Mar 2009 01:15:26 +0000 http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=761#comment-6300 I’d say that the only real reason for paying the AIG bonuses is the whole contract issue. As annoying as it is, it’s part of a larger Rule of Law thing–the contracts guaranteeing bonuses to the people who ruined the livelihoods of millions are repellent, but then, so is seeing rapists, child molesters, and terrorists get a right to a fair trial. We do it, though, because of the larger principle.

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By: fridaykr https://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/blog/2009/03/17/two-cents-on-aig/comment-page-1/#comment-6299 Tue, 17 Mar 2009 23:44:53 +0000 http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=761#comment-6299 I didn’t hear Calomiris, and even if I had, I wouldn’t have considered his argument very compelling. The better arguments I have read for honoring the bonuses–and mind you, I don’t necessarily find these that compelling–are threefold. One, there is a contractural obligation to honor bonuses. Two, the bonuses are needed to retain those responsible for constructing the toxic credit default swaps, if merely because these “experts” are now needed to unwind the house of cards they constructed. (Your points about the likelyhood of AIG employees leaving are well taken.) Three, if these purveyors of credit default swaps leave AIG, they may be able to use their priviledged knowledge of AIG’s swaps to bet against the company, to the wider detriment of the market.

At face value, these seem like better arguments that than the ones Calomiris was espousing, if only because they attempt to speak to our own interests, not just those of Wall St. or AIG. Unfortunately, I lack the financial background to assess the merits of the above arguments. For example, I would really like to know the extent to which the over $50 trillion in credit default swaps worldwide (obviously not all AIG’s) can only be “unwound” by a select few. I find this hard to believe, frankly. I also need to be shown how, in this market environment, inside knowledge of credit default positions confers a trading advantage that could harm others. Maybe this is true, but someone needs to explain it to me.

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