Comments on: Lloyd Alexander and Moral Instruction https://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/blog/2007/05/21/lloyd-alexander-and-moral-instruction/ Culture, Politics, Academia and Other Shiny Objects Wed, 30 May 2007 07:54:56 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=5.4.15 By: Doug https://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/blog/2007/05/21/lloyd-alexander-and-moral-instruction/comment-page-1/#comment-3629 Wed, 30 May 2007 07:54:56 +0000 http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=377#comment-3629 Hmm. The Ender books get more problematic as they go on. There’s a significant online discussion about the problems of the first book. The second is the one that had the strongest impact on me, though I’m sure it’s been at least 15 years since I read it. The fourth I remember as just all about obsessive-compulsive disorder.

The later books might have been decent if he had swallowed his hatred of Clinton and written about reasonably real people, but he couldn’t and he didn’t and they aren’t. (It’s remotely possible that the last two Bean books got better, but the first two were so bad that I didn’t make the effort.)

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By: Patrick Cooper https://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/blog/2007/05/21/lloyd-alexander-and-moral-instruction/comment-page-1/#comment-3628 Tue, 29 May 2007 23:40:03 +0000 http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=377#comment-3628 Thanks very much for your posting. Being a good time removed from reading the books, I was looking for Prydain interpretations and found yours. I was surprised at how much what you said meshed with a series I’d read more recently (but not much more recently), the Ender stories from Orson Scott Card. The issues beyond swords and fantasy, the issues and their complicated scope fleshed out through a young setting, etc.

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By: Timothy Burke https://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/blog/2007/05/21/lloyd-alexander-and-moral-instruction/comment-page-1/#comment-3626 Thu, 24 May 2007 20:57:54 +0000 http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=377#comment-3626 I completely agree that the Taran books lend themselves to individual moral benefits. (This could be, in some sense, my point: that the books suggest that we come to our morals through hard-won experience.)

I thought of Gurgi as a kind of ape-man with a sort of doggy/Cookie Monsterish face.

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By: withywindle https://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/blog/2007/05/21/lloyd-alexander-and-moral-instruction/comment-page-1/#comment-3625 Thu, 24 May 2007 02:28:12 +0000 http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=377#comment-3625 I should add (!): part of the reason I’m going at such length is because I, too, loved the Taran books; and Taran Wanderer matters a great deal to me too–a book I didn’t like when very young, but liked the most when a little bit older; a book by which I realized my own changing tastes, and more consciously realized that a grimmer, quieter book can be a better book. And since the Taran books did help make me what I am–including, as I saw, a writer–I am somewhat unhappy about having them drafted to make a political point with which I certainly don’t agree. I don’t insist that the proper reader of Alexander should share my politics–at a guess, Alexander didn’t–but I do object to claims that a proper reading of Alexander leads to different politics, different educational philosophies, etc. I like to think that whatever moral benefit we all acquired from reading the Taran books is individual, not crudely political.

That said, the democratic temperament of the final two books has been an enduring influence on me. Again, it shouldn’t map onto any fleeting partisan political position. But much of what I believe–much of what I have argued here over the years–draws upon that temperament of Alexander.

On a completely different note–who else had an image of the Cookie Monster in their head when they read about Gurgi?

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By: Timothy Burke https://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/blog/2007/05/21/lloyd-alexander-and-moral-instruction/comment-page-1/#comment-3624 Thu, 24 May 2007 00:58:12 +0000 http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=377#comment-3624 No, it’s fine. Sorry for the delay. I have no idea why WordPress holds stuff when it does (it often puts my own comments into moderation). I was just tied up with family business today.

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By: emschwar https://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/blog/2007/05/21/lloyd-alexander-and-moral-instruction/comment-page-1/#comment-3623 Wed, 23 May 2007 22:01:39 +0000 http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=377#comment-3623 Like others, I hadn’t really thought of Alexander and Moral Instruction(tm), but I’m pleasantly surprised to discover, upon reflection, that it was really there all along. What a delightful discovery!

Interesting that others brought in Narnia; I tend to group Alexander with Susan Cooper, by preference. Her Dark is Rising series doesn’t tend so much towards Moral Instruction, though The Grey King is full of it, and the conclusion of the series is essentially a discussion of what human freedoms mean to us.

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By: withywindle https://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/blog/2007/05/21/lloyd-alexander-and-moral-instruction/comment-page-1/#comment-3622 Wed, 23 May 2007 18:56:57 +0000 http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=377#comment-3622 I wrote a rather long response to this–it’s a comment currently awaiting moderation. I’ve posted it also at

http://bigapplederm.blogspot.com/

Tim, if you’d just as soon not accept the post in your comments, due to length, that’s OK.

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By: Gavin Weaire https://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/blog/2007/05/21/lloyd-alexander-and-moral-instruction/comment-page-1/#comment-3621 Wed, 23 May 2007 16:33:58 +0000 http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=377#comment-3621 One of the genuine strikes against Tolkien is the general awfulness of his high fantasy epigoni. The Prydain series is the only real counter-example to this argument.

One nice effect of the authentic moral experience of reading the preceding stuff comes when the reader finally encounters the one “get out of jail free” card in the story. When Eilonwy’s ring means that she doesn’t have to leave Taran after all, it doesn’t feel fake and too easy, but rather, well, “magical,” a miraculous suspension of the narrative logic that has governed the rest of the story.

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By: Brad https://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/blog/2007/05/21/lloyd-alexander-and-moral-instruction/comment-page-1/#comment-3620 Wed, 23 May 2007 15:26:02 +0000 http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=377#comment-3620 s work. I just ordered it and told my fourth grader that he will have some good books to read on his annual summer pilgrimage to Finland (to visit his mother's family). I'll read them before he leaves. Because of the discussion here, I will be curious as to what he pulls out of them.]]> Thanks for the tip. I read all the stories discussed here except for Alexander’s work. I just ordered it and told my fourth grader that he will have some good books to read on his annual summer pilgrimage to Finland (to visit his mother’s family). I’ll read them before he leaves. Because of the discussion here, I will be curious as to what he pulls out of them.

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By: laurel https://blogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/blog/2007/05/21/lloyd-alexander-and-moral-instruction/comment-page-1/#comment-3619 Wed, 23 May 2007 11:00:23 +0000 http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?p=377#comment-3619 Somebody call Aristotle!

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